|
|
Post by beef on May 1, 2016 11:40:41 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by Zenrider on May 1, 2016 13:07:30 GMT
It's kind of like having to explain a joke don't you think?
|
|
|
|
Post by beef on May 1, 2016 13:16:24 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by Zenrider on May 1, 2016 13:26:19 GMT
Somehow missed it, keep telling you I'm his worst fan, makes this forum ironic or something doesn't it? anyway it was new to me.  |
|
|
|
Post by beef on May 1, 2016 13:37:06 GMT
Me too. . .
|
|
|
|
Post by calndel on May 2, 2016 15:33:08 GMT
the point of music is simple
it's just another form of communication of mainly emotions
|
|
|
|
Post by sc on May 4, 2016 10:14:45 GMT
Why do we have Music and Art? It is the major reason for the Rise and Survival of the human race. That may sound bonkers but bear with me. Some may remember me saying this before on the old good site.
Firstly, what is the difference between talking and singing? Inflections, singing does not use inflections within the words.
We need to go back and look at the very early human, what were its’ advantages and disadvantages compared to its’ environment in which it lived.
Disadvantages:
We are weak – anyone want a hand to hand fight with another ape of the same size? Say a small Gorilla, Chimp or Baboon? No they would rip your head off in a blink of an eye.
Protection – We would be preyed on. We have very poor protection, our skin is thin and weak, it is not covered in thick fur or hair we do not have any armour, Shell, bone plating, horns or smells to deter preditors.
Weapons – Animals that hunt have natural weapons, fangs, long shape teeth, claws, we have none of these, we have no weapons.
Gestation and childbirth – we have long gestation period which puts the female at high risk from preditors and moving long distances. Childbirth is long, hard, painful and very dangerous compared to other animals, therefore again easy pickings for preditors.
Childhood – extremely long, most animals that are preyed upon can get to their feet and run very quickly, a human gets to their feet after about a year and could not run effectively with the pack for 12 or 13 years.
Eye sight – we are also preditors, our eyesight compared to other major hunters in the animal world, ours is dreadful.
Sense of smell, ours is at a very basic level, we may be able to smell a curry or coffee shop around the corner but we can’t smell an animal dying 5 miles away!
We were very few in number.
Advantages:
We have a huge brain.
We have a very good sense of taste.
We have a huge vocal range
As you can see the odds were firmly stacked against us, any betting man would not put money down on this experiment by nature surviving long.
But it was our brain, that helped us, we were able to look at things in the abstract and solve problems far far better than any other animal, we kept together in packs to help build our strength. 10 weak humans vs 1 chimp in hand to hand combat and we have a better chance!
Our problem was that although we could problem solve, we needed to communicate that with our fellow humans and so basic methods of communication developed.
These very early communication methods would have been to our ear now basic noises, without the sophistication of words or inflections that we now use in speech, the very important elements of this early language are still with us today, things like laughter, crying, shock, screaming, terror, anger, passion, sadness, happy, content, safe, relaxed, pointing etc. this level of language (or noise) is so primeval that it does not matter what modern language you speak it is clearly understood. The noises are so ancient to us they are instinctive, all of the noises have one thing in common – No Inflections.
A baby, communicates with cries, laughter, gurgles and coos, the mother responds, with soothing coos and gurgles, in every modern language the language between mother and baby is the same, it is the first basic instinctive language of humans. Again no inflections.
This language developed as more ideas were shared between humans and “words” developed, at this stage it is unreasonable to expect inflections to have been used and so early speech would have been “songlike” ie no inflections, perhaps like rap today. This would have continued for hundreds of thousands of years and would now be firmly embedded into our sub-consciousness.
This form of “no inflections” also had the huge advantage of communicating over longer distances, look at Yodeling compared to shouting.
As humans progressed greater levels of detail was needed, this is where what we call “Art” stepped in. Humans were a scarce resource, it took 13 odd years of huge investment to grow a baby to a useful hunting, fighting, fertile, human. You are not going to waste such a precious resource by letting it learn how to hunt Mammoths “on the job”, we needed to find a better way, this problem was solved by inventing “drawing” because of our abstract thinking brain, we could see how some mud smeared on a cave wall could represent a Mammoth, and so the young hunter could be trained how and where to attack and what others will do all from the safety of cave.
This skill developed with greater and greater detail eventually using 3D models. Again, this form of communication is now strongly embedded into our sub-consciousness.
As humans continued to thrive, the need for better and better communication continued and so a more sophisticated method of communication slowly developed with the introduction of “inflections” and more and more words. However, the ancient language style was still instinctive and quick to learn, and so teaching etc may still use the ancient style but with more sophisticated words, so reverting to “no inflections”. Everyone can relate to be able to sing a simple song after listening to it a few time pretty much word perfect, but could you recite a page from a book someone read to you a few times? No of course not, the removal of inflections, means the ancient primeval brain is listening and absorbing the information. Some cultures do still teach, pass on tribal history , etc in the form of song and chant.
As the sophistication of communication developed so the need for the ancient ways of communication decreased, but because of the ease of understanding by using the primeval brain, it still had a roll and a human demand for its’ use. And so it was used for “Spiritual”, “Pleasurable” and “Teaching”. Basic instruments, would start being used, drums, reed instruments etc. To focus attention or emotions etc. And so what we now call Music, Song and Art moved from the prime weapon of survival to an enjoyable activity.
A further piece of evidence to support this and perhaps not that PC (I am not trying to be confrontational just looking at humans as an animal) is sexual attractiveness, again lets go back to the basic human, what makes someone attractive?
For a basic human female, she has a huge and long risk in raising a child to say 13 years, she needs a male that will survive a long time, be able to protect provide food and shelter until the child has grown and hopefully through to the end of her life, therefore, fitness, a good brain, good social skills, that hopefully will result in good social status are all good assets for her male to have, they will give security and safety and may be passed on to her child and is therefore attractive.
For a basic human male, may look for, is the female fit, will childbirth be ok, does she have good social skills, will she be able to feed the child, does she have a good brain, will she gain social status?
Therefore, with humans, attractiveness is connected to the ability to survive and thrive, a good hunter, a leader, a good mother all are attractive.
I have already talked about how Music and Art in its’ earliest form was the primary reason for the success of the humans, so people with strong aptitude towards these skills will be highly prized by the tribe/pack and would have very high status and therefore attractiveness. This attractiveness is still registered in our primeval brains. A homeless busker singing a fabulously emotional song that touches your heart will be attractive to you regardless that they are penniless.
Music, Song and Art are therefore essential to us as the basic definition of being human, It touches our primeval soul, emotions and memories, it transcends all other languages, it is as important as breathing.
|
|
|
|
Post by beef on May 4, 2016 19:07:32 GMT
. . . I think that's more or less it SC! - Alain De Botton 3/10 - must do better!
|
|
|
|
Post by sc on May 4, 2016 22:10:58 GMT
Cheers Beef  very much appreciated, I missed one other point about humans and "Song, Music, Art" these are the ONLY subjects that if a human is rubbish at wishes beyond anything that they were good at, other subjects that they are not good at they generally dislike. If you are rubbish at numbers you will not long to be a statistician, BUT the the vast majority of humans who cannot sing, create art or play an instrument would give anything to. Because maths is not primeval, Physics is not primeval, Geography is not primeval, but Music, Art and Song is primeval SURVIVAL and so the urge that we MUST do this is still instinctive. |
|
very much appreciated, 
